Creative Community - Escape Motions
16.04.2020
konrad76
portfolio

One of basic things you can do with real watercolor is re-activating dry pigment using water.

I haven't found any way to achieve it with Rebelle after drying or fast-drying the layer.

If you are aware of a good way to do it, please share.

 

To give a bit more practical example:

Let's say i have a hard edge in my painting because I put a stroke of watercolor over already dried layer of pigment (and dried it again). Now I want to blend this edge. If I use Blend or Smudge tool, the pigment will not be affected by paper the same way as re-activated wet watercolor would be (e.g. paper texture shows differently). Using water also doesn't help because dried pigment seems to be permanently "baked in", smudge & blend do not react with water.

 

05.05.2020
Veronika EscapeMotions
portfolio

Hi @konrad76,

you can either use water tool from the Tools panel or set the Smudge to "Smudge only wet". If this is not what you're looking for, how would you like to see this feature implemented?

08.05.2020
konrad76
portfolio

Hi Veronika,

No, actually these methods don't achieve it.

As far as I can see, once you FastDry or Dry layer, all pigment is "frozen". You can blend and smudge it, but it will not interact if you put more water on it or you put more wet strokes on it.

To be clear, sometimes this is what you want. But sometimes it would be good to be able to re-activate the pigment already laid down. This would most likely have to be a new tool or a new setting for existing tool (e.g. Smudge, Blend or Water tool). E.g. user might have option to put water while also un-drying all the pigment underneath it.

I don't know exactly how fluid model and paper/pigment interaction in Rebelle work - therefore all my conclusions are from reverse-engineering application's behaviour. As per my other comments, it would be nice to have more information about it - then I might be able to figure out by myself if this is ever possible or not.

15.05.2020
avb27
portfolio

I've had this issue has well.

 

Additionally, saving a file seems to be equivalent to using Fast Dry. Even if my paint is in the process of blending, this will immediately stop once I save.

That means that I absolutely have to complete any sections of my painting that require wet paint before I save, otherwise it will never be able to blend the same way again (as konrad stated, you can still use the blend and smudge tools, but these create a less natural look).

 

This behavior is going to lead me to save less and become more vulnerable to losing all of my work in the event of a software crash.

 

Personally, my preferred solution would just be to make any wet tools (watercolor brush, water tool, ink pen) reactivate dried pigment relative to the degree of wetness. So a brush set to 1% water wouldn't disturb dried pigment, it would just paint over it. And a brush set to 100% water would completely re-activied dried pigment and blend with it. I think this would match the behavior of real watercolor.

15.05.2020
Veronika EscapeMotions
portfolio

Hi @konrad76,

this is a nice idea, the implementation is a bit questionable here.

We could implement a slider to Visual settings with a range from 0 to 10. 
The maximum value of 10 would mean that while painting with a new color on the color beneath (previously dried), the current color would completely rewet the color below so it will be removed from the paper and will flow together/integrate with the current painting color.

Or we could implement another button that would only stop the diffusion visually when dried but in reality, everything remains wet.
The logic behind Rebelle's Layers buttons would, in such case, need to be re-considered.

What would help us is if you send us an example of how you would like to see this feature behave on canvas. Best if recorded on a video either from R3 or from a traditional paint.

22.05.2020
konrad76
portfolio

Hi Veronika,

 

I think your ideas of this feature are valid, personally I *think* first one sounds a bit more intuitive to me.

avb27@ proposes behaviour that attempts to mimic the real watecolor. This sounds also ok, although why stop there.

Sometimes you want to reactivate what's below, sometimes you want it to stay baked into picture no matter how much water you apply over it. (This is better than reality :))

I would propose another approach. Again, I am not privy to design details, but you might try to limit this effect to Water tool.

You might have a checkbox in Water tool that says 'reactivate'. Only if reactivation is enabled the water would pick up pigment from below (only the visible color). At the same time the dried color would be removed. I am not sure how it would fit into the model, your designers know best.

these videos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=441zE7tETQs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qy_8px43Esc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltIz0arDKeg

show some related techniques. They focus mostly on lifting (reactivating in order to remove), but also show reactivating with water in order to blend, which is a more interesting case.